tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9479398.post824915168001379310..comments2024-03-28T11:33:16.271-05:00Comments on Adventus: "God setteth the solitary in families"Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9479398.post-16089069842586677172013-04-03T08:41:45.861-05:002013-04-03T08:41:45.861-05:00I understand the "death" argument, Rick....I understand the "death" argument, Rick. As I say, it's a moral problem, one balanced in law by the demand of the state, in a truly anti-abortion stance, that the pregnancy be carried to term no matter the consequences to the mother.<br /><br />I don't see how that doesn't run afoul of the 13th Amendment, though I know no legal argument is ever made on that ground. But to force someone to do something against their will is, it seems to me, slavery: pure and simple.<br /><br />To compel, the strength and only authority of morality, is another matter. Is abortion moral? That is a separate question from: should it be legal?<br /><br />As for the "Mainstream opposition to abortion," my comment was meant to be illustrative of the apparent attitude of lawmakers around the country who seem hellbent on banning abortions and who usually speak in terms of the "convenience" of abortions. Even the Clintonian "safe, legal, and rare" presumes a certain moral laxity on the part of women seeking abortions. You must agree the general tone of the discussions seldom regards women as human beings, but rather as either victims of society's lax moral standards, or as evil snuffers of life. There is a great deal of emotion generated around this subject, and it has done little to refute the "Madonna/whore" image still too often attributed to women in general.<br /><br />I don't, on the other hand, want an emotional argument about this subject. I've tried teaching argument in classrooms, and while it helps to bring up topics that are controversial just to get the students to pay attention, I always avoid abortion because it is so inflammatory. I hesitated a long time before posting this.<br /><br />We can all draw different conclusions from personal experiences, and my conclusion is that, while abortion may raise important moral questions, those questions do no override the important legal questions. I may not counsel an abortion in a situation, if asked my opinion of its propriety; but neither do I think the law should forbid it outright, if only because the rich will continue to get abortions, and the poor will resort to back alleys.<br /><br />In this matter, the law is very much a blunt instrument, and I prefer to see it stay out of the issue.Rmjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06811456254443706479noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9479398.post-13330798341534619832013-04-03T07:41:43.820-05:002013-04-03T07:41:43.820-05:00I do not hope to change anyone's mind on this ...I do not hope to change anyone's mind on this contentious issue, but I can hope that we at least understand each other's differences.<br /><br />So far as I know, no mainstream opposition to abortion is based on a desire to shame "whores or sluts or party girls or strumpets, or...sorority vixens with rich daddies." All agree that pregnant women are human beings. The question, of course, is whether another human being is involved. Until Roe v. Wade transformed those persons, in law, from persons to things, the question looked quite different.<br /><br />Of course every situation is wrenching, and I have known a number of young women who have had abortions. Many of the circumstances have increased my scepticism about its liberating potential--"If anything goes wrong, I'll pay for the abortion" seems to have become standard in the rhetoric of exploitation. <br /><br />There are also the real faces of those who have defied the odds. I know one young woman, adopted, whose mother was turned away from a clinic by the intervention of protestors. Another child I know was born in the face of extreme pressure from his (very wealthy) father to abort him. It is real people like this who keep me from analogizing the decision to abort to decisions about what neighborhood one should live in, or what stores one should shop at. I don't expect you, or most people, will agree. But I hope you can at least see that, for some few of us, involving as it does direct killing, it is as grave a matter as the needless mass deaths from the reckless wars our country has ignited in Iraq and Afganistan. rick allenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07612435616018593956noreply@blogger.com